Mormonism LIVE: 033: President Nelson’s Flight of Death

Today We explore a story President Nelson has told for years about a flight he was on in the 1970’s. He reports the plane’s engine exploding, the wing catching fire, a death spiral by the plane, the chaos aboard, and the plane’s landing in a farmer’s field. This story had many questioning the truthfulness of his account but there was never a smoking gun to get to the truth of the matter………. until now.

WHERE PRESIDENT NELSON OR OTHERS HAVE TOLD THE STORY

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/1992/05/doors-of-death?lang=eng

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/article/president-nelson-argentina-2019

https://www.deseret.com/faith/2021/3/28/22355277/president-nelson-invites-all-to-feel-the-peace-and-hope-of-easter-by-focusing-on-the-savior

https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=EMwKxmTLaCs&ab_channel=TheChurchofJesusChristofLatter-daySaints

Russell M. Nelson, From Heart to Heart: An Autobiography (Salt Lake City: Nelson, 1979)

Russell M. Nelson: Father, Surgeon, Apostle – Spencer J Condie: Author

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/friend/1994/06/most-important?lang=eng Russell M. Nelson, The Gateway We Call Death (Salt Lake City: Deseret Book, 1995)

https://www.thechurchnews.com/archives/2004-09-18/gospel-principles-vital-to-correct-living-94995

https://www.deseret.com/2006/4/15/19948411/death-is-part-of-life-ex-surgeon-says

https://www.thechurchnews.com/leaders-and-ministry/2018-09-03/president-nelson-delivers-historic-message-to-dominican-latter-day-saints-in-spanish-8931

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/church/news/president-nelson-shares-5-lessons-life-has-taught-me-with-49000-in-safeco-field?lang=eng

https://www.thechurchnews.com/leaders-and-ministry/2018-10-26/president-nelson-finds-church-thriving-in-uruguay-thanks-to-multiple-generations-of-members-missionaries-156122

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/article/president-nelson-argentina-2019

THE CLAIMS PRESIDENT NELSON HAS MADE THAT WERE RED FLAGS

1.) One Engine on a small Two Engine plane Exploded.
2.) Said Engine caught fire.
3.) In the Explosion flammable material was spread to the plane and the plane itself was on fire.
4.) The plane did a “Death Spiral” which extinguished the fire
5.) The Pilot “turned on the Other Engine”
6.) The plane landed in a “Farmer’s Field”

THE FACTS THAT ALLOWED OTHERS TO NARROW WHAT TO LOOK FOR

 1.) The Date of the flight was reported as November 12, 1976
2.) He was flying from SLC to St. George to attend the inauguration of W. Rolfe Kerr as the president of Dixie College.
3.) Anytime a plane incurs a malfunction or there is a mechanical flight issue or pilot error the Law requires such to be recorded. The Explosion would necessitate a publicly available recorded log report. The plane on fire would necessitate a publicly available recorded log report. The Death Spiral would necessitate a publicly available recorded log report. The landing in a Farmer’s Field would necessitate a publicly available recorded log report.

IF THE STORY OCCURRED THE WAY PRESIDENT NELSON HAS REPORTED, THERE ABSOLUTELY WOULD BE A REPORT THAT IS PUBLICLY AVAILABLE. MOST FABRICATIONS HINGE ON SOME GRAIN OF TRUTH, SO MANY IN THE POST-MORMON COMMUNITY WENT INTO DETECTIVE MODE.

THE FLIGHT REPORT FOR THIS FLIGHT WAS FINALLY LOCATED (IT WAS DIFFICULT TO FIND DUE TO THE MUNDANE ISSUES INCURRED THAT SEEMINGLY CONTRADICT NELSON’S STORY )



https://www.google.com/books/edition/_/wNa3AAAAIAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&pg=PA1090&dq=skywest+incidents+1976

1.) Engine never exploded and continued to run though rough
2.) There was no Engine Fire.
3.) The Plane itself was never on fire
4.) The Other Engine was never off
4.) The plane made a “Precautionary landing at the airport in Delta Utah and not a farmer’s field
5.) There are other smaller issues with number of passengers, length of flight, cutting fuel line to both engines, and the date of the flight but we grant some benefit of the doubt for distorted memory.

If the Church or its defenders want to claim the conclusion that this flight one day earlier is NOT the flight President Nelson is speaking about, then the burden of proof is on them to provide the evidence. To claim there was another “SKY WEST” flight also going from SLC TO SAINT GEORGE” that had “WORSE ISSUES” “ONE DAY LATER”, then provide the “MANDATORY PUBLICLY AVAILABLE FLIGHT REPORT” of said flight. Without such, said conclusion by the defenders would require more conjecture and allowances.


The Plane believed to be the One Nelson rode that day

Play

Mormonism LIVE: 032: Lindsay Hansen Park – Troubling Aspects of Joseph Smith’s Polygamy

We sit down with Lindsay Hansen Park, host of “The Year of Polygamy” podcast and discuss the most troubling aspects of Joseph Smith’s polygamy and LDS Polygamy at large. Lucy Walker, the Partridge Sisters, Fanny Alger, Helen Mar Kimball, and others.

RESOURCES:

https://www.yearofpolygamy.com/

https://mormondiscussionpodcast.org/2017/12/premium-lucy-walker-spiritual-experiences/

https://mormondiscussionpodcast.org/2019/08/mormon-discussion-342-nancy-rigdon-and-the-happiness-letter/

mormondiscussionpodcast.org/2020/08/gospel-topic-essays-011-plural-marriage-in-kirtland-and-nauvoo/

http://wivesofjosephsmith.org/2021-EmilyandElizaPartridge.htm

Also don’t forget to support Sunstone by purchasing the magazine or better yet register and attend the Sunstone Symposium by clicking this link https://sunstonemagazine.com/registration/

Lindsay Hansen Park is an American Mormon feminist blogger, podcaster, and the Executive Director for the Salt Lake City-based non-profit Sunstone Education Foundation. She blogs for Feminist Mormon Housewives (FMH) about women’s issues inside and outside of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. She is the main voice behind the Year of Polygamy podcast. Her work and voice have been referenced in The Wall Street Journal, The Salt Lake Tribune’s Trib Talk, Salt Lake City Weekly, The Guardian and Quartz.

Play

Mormonism LIVE: 031: Property Purchases & Changed Countenances

Today we catch up on current events namely discussing the recent property purchases by the Church in Washington and Hawaii. We then discuss the recent language of judgement by famous LDS author and now General Authority (second counselor in the Young Men general presidency) Brad Wilcox about how those who leave can be seen to have their Countenances changed for the worse and seem to have their lives in a mess. If there is time we will also hit on the possible removal of the “Becoming Like God” Gospel Topic Essay.

RESOURCES:

https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2021/06/24/latest-mormon-land-church/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0W71YTn_fE

https://abn.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/1975/10/the-privilege-of-holding-the-priesthood?lang=eng&fbclid=IwAR0thqKeYOxHIZK_x4RDeDvsOM4-aYvI6eeh8VCDPuQYvZyk9XRCBeDlgpE

Play

Mormonism LIVE : 028: John Dehlin and the Origination of Mormon Stories

Today we wit down with John Dehlin, host of Mormon Stories and Pioneer who blazed the trail into historical transparency regarding Mormon History and Social Dysfuntion using the internet as the vehicle. His podcast pioneered a new phase in Mormonism where Scholars talked openly and and the Church could be held accountable for its unhealthiness.

Play

Mormonism LIVE ! : 027: Spencer Wright – Apologetic Logical Fallacies

We sit down with author, Spencer Wright, to talk about Logical Fallacies. We will examine a few ways in which certain fallacies are used in Mormonism and help the viewer/listener grasp how irrational certain apologetic arguments are. How Mormon Apologists carefully move the person investigating truth claims and history to making room for anything that it possible even if that thing is highly unlikely and do so in ways that one feels comfortable maintaining belief even though that belief may be irrational.

Spencer Wright is the author of the book, “How To Think: Why Rational and Faith Based Thinking Are In Compatible”

RESOURCES:

Spencer’s Book “How To Think” https://www.amazon.com/How-Think-Spencer-K-Wright/dp/1986747069

https://thebestschools.org/magazine/15-logical-fallacies-know/

https://blog.hubspot.com/marketing/common-logical-fallacies

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies

https://writingcenter.unc.edu/tips-and-tools/fallacies/

http://utminers.utep.edu/omwilliamson/ENGL1311/fallacies.htm

Play

Mormonism LIVE !: 025: The Adam God Deception

Mormonism has placed each believer into having to choose which Prophets you believe and which Prophets you don’t. Choosing which Prophets are right about the views they hold claiming they got them from God and which prophets were simply wrong claiming something came from God when it must surely be their own false view since the views are contradictory. In the end the disagreement seems so obviously contradictory that one must choose one claim over the other which leaves them dismissing a prophet and having that prophet apparently unable to discern between the voice of God and his own false imagination. And once you admit that prophets and those who place faith in them are no more able to discern truth from error via the Holy Ghost…… Then how does one navigate with certainty about their own spiritual knowings and those of the prophets when one could be misled this easily. And the Cherry on top is the LDS Church’s continued Deception around the issue including misleading members by articulating the issue as if Brigham didn’t teach it through their talks, the Church manuals, and private letters demanding silence.

RESOURCES:

https://www.fairlatterdaysaints.org/answers/Question:Was_the%22Adam-God%22_theory_ever_taught_as_part_of_the_temple_endowment_ceremony_as_something_called_%22the_lecture_at_the_veil%22%3F

https://abn.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/1975/04/a-self-inflicted-purging?lang=eng

https://abn.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/1976/10/our-own-liahona?lang=eng

https://abn.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/1980/10/adam-the-archangel?lang=eng

https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/bruce-r-mcconkie/seven-deadly-heresies/#byu-header

http://www.eugeneengland.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/BRM-to-EE-Feb-80-Combined.pdf

https://abn.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/teachings-brigham-young/chapter-14?lang=eng

https://journalofdiscourses.com/9/27

https://abn.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/teachings-brigham-young/chapter-4?lang=eng

https://www.journalofdiscourses.com/1/8

Play

Mormonism LIVE!: 021: Sexual Allegation Against John Dehlin Goes Down In Flames

This Week RFM and Bill Reel takes a deeper look at the an old allegation that has been dragged out once again by critics against John Dehlin. And specifically the facts and documentation surrounding the case. And what do they find…… but that the claims the alleged victim seems to contain two major discrepancies. One is her motivation which seems riddled with blackmail and manipulation and the other seems to strike at the heart of her claims, namely her allegations countered by her very own text messages.

Exhibit A Blackmail Email – https://mormonismlive.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/Exhibit-A-Blackmail-Email.pdf

Exhibit B New Hampshire Complaint – https://mormonismlive.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/Exhibit-B-New-Hampshire-Complaint-redacted.pdf

Exhibit C Dehlin Statement – https://mormonismlive.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/Exhibit-C-Dehlin-OSF-Response.pdf

Exhibit D Anne’s Withdrawal – https://mormonismlive.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/Exhibit-D-Annes-Withdrawal.pdf

Exhibit E OSF Response – https://mormonismlive.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/Exhibit-E-OSF-Response.pdf

First aired 6:20 PM Mountain Time April 28th 2021

Play

Mormonism LIVE: 020: Natasha Helfer’s Court of Love & Kwaku’s Bait And Switch

A lot happened this past Sunday in Mormonism. Natasha Helfer had a disciplinary court and later in the week was excommunicated. And Kwaku coming off of our interview attempted to drive people to video drudging up old allegations against John Dehlin but encasing it in a bait and switch put over on people as “My apology to John Dehlin”. We tackle both of those as well as some looking back at last weeks conversation with Kwaku and some of the things he said and if they hold up to critical thinking.

Play

Mormonism LIVE: 019: Kwaku El Live in Studio

Live Show on Wednesdays 6:20 PM Mountain Time on Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5n_8_6j00PSeju0hu2CFXQ
Kwaku El in Studio for a Live Conversation about FAIR and Saints Unscripted Kwaku has graciously accepted our invitation to sit down on Mormonism LIVE ! with Radio Free Mormon and Bill Reel to discuss primarily his separating from Saints Unscripted and having projects he worked on that contributed to content on FAIR having been removed. We also touch on his feelings and thoughts regarding people who leave and the emotional turmoil such journeys encapsulate and We talk about whether he recognizes if the critics are reasonable in their approach and conclusion and if he is for that matter.

YOUTUBE VIDEO RECORDING of this episode – https://youtu.be/Kd7EdebQ194

Play

Mormonism LIVE ! : 018: Lazy Learners & Shrinkage

Mormonism LIVE ! – April 2021 General Conference Edition RFM and Bill Reel will sit down and review some of big happenings and talks in April 2021 General Conference. And if absolutely zilch happens, then we will address the recent handbook changes and discuss what they say about where they came from and where the Church moves forward because of those changes.

Recent Handbook Changes allowing single members more opportunities to serve – https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/article/general-handbook-update-march-2021

2020 Membership Report – https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/article/april-2021-general-conference-statistical-report

President Nelson’s Lazy Learner Talk – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VGCEQLzITk

Play